-
Website
http://consequenceofsound.net -
Original page
http://consequenceofsound.net/2008/06/09/album-review-rise-and-fall-rage-and-grace/ -
Subscribe
All Comments -
Community
-
-
Top Commenters
-
Popular Threads
All Comments
http://www.imeem.com/theoffspring
theyre loving it man.
no offense, but every review I have read in the last few months on this site has either been C/D or A's. Sometimes albums can be in the middle!
Bergy, I don't rate albums based on two or three sentence comments, either. Do people love it? Sure. Then again, if I were to base all opinion on public opinion, then what would be the point? And you must not be digging hard enough on this site, because the past few albums I've reviewed have been B's.
In fact, it was a running joke for awhile.
First of all, the production on this album really stands out, so I don't know where that "C" is coming from (let alone a D for "Sound"), cause this is arguably their best produced record (listen to it on headphones).
Second, a C+ for vocals ?! Are you kidding ? The backup vocals haven't sounded this good in years, and Dexter is actually singing in different tones on here, as well as the same tones used on the albums you actually liked, so I'm a bit confused by that.
Also, you complain about the "slower" songs, but you probably like "Dirty Magic" and "Amazed" to name just 2 previous slower Offspring tracks. And there is a difference between maturity and simply being older as musicians. Do you want them to be Lagwagon and put out the exact same album repeatedly ?
I'm not going to defend their past singles, but every one of their albums has had 4-5 wicked songs on them that are overlooked by the average listener because of a questionable (probably label insisted) first single.
And if you can't get over the fact that dexter wrote a song about a girl being abused, then I feel sorry for you. Ignition and Smash already exist, it's time to move on and enjoy this record for what it is - their most consistent release in over 10 years.
And that song "Kristy, Are You Doing Ok?" that you were bitching about being horrible and sappy; I think you should know that it was written about a girl he knew in high school that was raped/sexually abused. I bet you feel like an ass now.
And Bob, no I don't feel like an ass. The song still sounds exactly the way I described it, which is why I can't stand the song, and I still stand by what I said. Given the lyrics, it doesn't hold true instrumentally, and instead comes off as a cheap, overdone pop song, reminding me of the cheese and cliche mentality behind that fictional band, No Vacancy from School of Rock.
Look, I'm a huge fan of The Offspring. They've probably been one of my all time favorites for quite some time, and I agree Erock that many of their later albums have good songs on them, but overall? They've disappointed me with every release since Ixnay, and to a lesser extent Americana.
When I heard "Hammerhead", I was psyched, and the end result didn't match up to me. Do I want the same album? No. But, much like Blink-182, the act gets old at a certain age... and most bands are able to keep the same fan base by moving on, rather than trying to scale back... maturity. This hasn't been the case and like I said in every comment, they started mature and devolved into a joke... why continue that way?
Lyrically, this is a lot more serious, that much we can all agree with, but on the whole, it's very weak, especially given the time put behind it.
And I don't get your cynicism behind "professional review." Your attitude is a bit much.
That having been said, I am glad there is a forum here for those of us who really dug the album to air our grievances with your review, with the understanding that it is obviously your opinion.
As someone who grew tired of trying to defend the Offspring because of the (seemingly) standard 2-3 "Joke" songs per album from "Ixnay" on, I am very impressed with the amount of effort they've put into this album, especially since it doesn't have any joke songs to pull it down (I don't count "Shit is Fucked Up").
Personally, I'd rather have 3 "Ballads" than 3 "Jokes", and, as Bob was saying, we KNOW they can make a straight up punk album, they HAVE, they've now moved beyond that to simply writing good SONGS, and I respect that.
And you're getting a bit overemotional, don't you think? It's a review. Why should I think twice? I don't just pull out random statements for no reason. I did think twice, actually to appease you, I thought three times over.
And the D+ is in instrumentation, which I don't find impressive at all. Sorry.
Consequence of Sound is 100% independent and we allow comments so you can voice your thoughts on our reviews. But to mock, name call, or harass a reviewer is over the line, even for our standards. Personally, Mike is one of the greatest writers and musical minds I've ever encountered and I am honored to call him our Editor-in-Chief.
With that being said, if you think you can do better, than apply to write for us. We are always looking for new writers so if you think you can add/contribute a better point of view, show us what you got. Step up to the plate. Maybe then you'll realize we have no agenda, nor a bone to pick with any band.
http://consequenceofsound.net/about/want-to-write/
Half-Truism, You're Gonna Go Far Kid, and Takes Me Nowhere stand out as outstanding upbeat songs, while Kristy Are You Doing Okay is much better than I was expecting. Worst song you've ever heard? That doesn't even make sense.
I will agree that Rise and Fall sounds very similar to American Idiot, although I personally think that is a good thing. It has a catchy rhythm and beat and is a great way to finish off the album.
If there was a joke song on this CD, it would probably be Stuff is Messed Up. Although it is much better than any other joke song.
If I had to rate this CD, I would give it a 9 or 9.5 out of 10. A very good album and well worth the wait.
You're right.. probably because I didn't write that. I said it's the worst song they've put together. The lyrics don't match the tone at all and vice versa.
Maybe on more spins, I'd enjoy it. However, people reading this should note, I'm not bashing this album, I gave them an average grade. I did consider this a step back, in what I assumed would be a step forward... too bad in assumptions.
Instrumentation seems the same to me as past releases, but I'll agree that Half-Truism, You’re Gonna Go Far Kid, and Takes Me Nowhere are the stronger of the songs here.
"Thats your opinion, but you are being attacked here cause you went out of your way to say that this album was garbage in a really bullshit and roundabout manner.D in sound my ass. I have an opinion too. I’m gonna give you a D in your review for this album."
You’re entitled to your opinion as I am to mine. I give you an F for fluff and failure. You as a music fan fail to see what we do here on this site. Alex reiterated everything we do with excellent precision and much like Teddy Roosevelt’s criticism of the United States government, it’s a right that music be criticized to put bands in a much larger perspective.
As they say in Pittsburgh, “If yinz don’t take the heats, gets outta da kitchen!”
This is a well-written review, i enjoyed reding it, but I didn't agree with the opinion.
After Splinter, I was worried that the guys couldn't make a good album again. I was wrong. GET THIS ALBUM. If you want slightly easier than Smash, less poppish than Conspiracy of One, less sucky than Splinter and a perfect balance like Americana, this is for you. I personally liked Offspring's ability to write an awesome radio-friendly song (Want You Bad) and the ability to write headbanging masterpieces (Americana and Staring At The Sun) and now they have returned to this former awesomness. :-)
9.7 / 10. (Honestly, its that good, one of those albums where every song is good, a la Motion City Soundtrack's "Even If It Kills Me" and Less Than Jake's "In With The Out Crowd".)
I LOVE THESE GUYS. :-)
Later
Love from South Africa
Later
If you didn't like the record, fine! BUT YOU'RE JUST TRASHING A BAND FOR NO REASON AT ALL. And this is clearly the best record they've put out. And I'd rather listen to this one than Smash - which is a neat record if you don't like too much meat!
I actually love this album, i creamed my pants when i heard it. Well done to The Offspring!
Overall:Sound: A
Lyrics: A+
Production: A
Vocals: A
Overall: A
its definitly their best stuff since americana, but in my opinion, theyre best since ignition.
To me, I still consider it flawed. The beginning half had me going for awhile, but the latter half really falls flat. And as far as the complaints toward my grading in production? Well, the whole album sounds too glossy and polished, something that even Splinter didn't have. A more raw sound might have actually "saved" some of the songs that didn't click for me.
And regarding "Kristy", I was put off by the sound. It's a really serious song, but it comes off as so cheesy. That's actually where I'd say the album starts dwindling.
Again, a C- isn't a bad grade. It's average. I consider this an average album. That's three stars out of five... something I'm pretty sure most reviewers will be giving this.
Thanks for commenting after a breath or two. It's pleasant. Haha.
i.e. ohhh coulds of time
Overall:Sound: A
Lyrics: A+
Production: A
Vocals: A+
Overall: A
I really wish you had the credentials to critique music, but your comparisons are weak and your judgements are completely baseless.
But don't take my word for it, read the barrage of angry comments on your weakass review.
Well, now that we know what obsessed Offspring fans think, let's turn the tables some:
http://www.punknews.org/article/29204
I'm not alone in my review, pal.
Bye Matt.
You are a skilled writer and it was a well-written review. I guess our opinions on this album were so different that I found myself infuriated. I think it was the My Chemical Romance and Panic! at the Disco comparisons that truly sent me over the edge. At least you acknowledged that Offspring cemented some of these styles in the first place, but why compare YGGFK to Panic!? Just because he said the word 'dance'? That sound in particular felt like a success to me, and I consider the album in whole to be a triumph.
You're Gonna Go Far Kid
A lot Like Me
Trust In You
Takes Me Nowhere
These songs are going to last a long time in my playlist. I wasn't expecting an album quite this good, so it pleases me to be able to say that The Offspring have proven that they haven't lost their touch.
I will agree on one thing though...'Kristy' walks a fine line between serious and cheesy. Catchy as it is, I still can't decide if I like it or not.
I compared the song to Panic! because that's what it sounds like instrumentally. The drum beat and the poppy click it goes off of is very similar to that Panic!/Fall Out Boy sound. And "Half Truism" is one of the best tracks here, but that chorus sounds very My Chemical Romance (think "Helena).
Always accept comments, man. No problems.
Trust me, I get heated too... usually in my boxers, in the morning, when I'm reading my favorite bands getting .01s on Pitchfork.
It's all relative.
Mike and Alex we all appreciate this site alot, I know I do. I check it daily and has become my go-to site for music news. And Mike your writing style is great, albeit a bit pretentious high style, but you def know your music history.
I found it curious how Coldplay, "the best band in the world," got such a great review. However, I have not heard the entire album but I am hopeful it lives up to the hype.
For the record, I do not know a single person that knows anything about music who liked American Idiot.
I'm happy they're making music, too. If you read the review, you'll see I appreciate a lot of the music here. I'm lost on where people consider me bashing, especially if I'm giving supporting evidence.
It's funny you mention the Coldplay review. It's actually seen quite the similar response to this.
Anyhow, good to be on base with you. As far as American Idiot goes, check out the reviews and look at the touring data and the band's success, obviously people were out there for it. And with good reason.. the album is consistent and great.
But that's another argument, altogether.
See ya soon!
Now, we're going to have a nation full of Kristys, Kristies, and Kristens all saying, "Dexter is singing about me! This is my song." It's the Carly Simon Complex, I suppose, and once again, the content doesn't match up. Dexter, please make a public service announcement! I know three Kristys, and I just won't be able to take it.
mm
Anyway, I think I'll save some venom for the impending "2.7" pitchfork review (if we're lucky). Like you said, that's usually when I get the most worked up anyway. "Oh, this band's on a major label ? 1.7", "Whoa, mindless white noise and screeching ?! 9.6 !!". Weak.
Maybe this album if played by Green day could rated a , 5 stars, or 10.
Yet, the conclusion I draw is contrary: I LOVE THE ALBUM!!
It's because of the expectations that I put into that band: Would I want music which is demanding or difficult, The Offspring were just the last band I'd listen to. I mean I've been a huge fan for years and will be for as long as they're around. But still: You listen to their songs over and over again because they stay in your mind, because they're just cool and not because it's the elaborate music ever written!
So I agree for instance that "Kristy" is very poppy and cheesy but why not? It still is a lovely song and a nice tune. And it's a great deal better than most of today's pop songs!! ;-)
And what's wrong with sing along choruses? Nothing (in MY opinion)
And it's true: the sound is polished and probably a little much so, but it sounds good to me and that's what counts! (and it's not as exaggerated as with groups like My Chemical Romance or Simple Plan by the way)
Having read the review I know for sure that I'm gonna buy the album and that I'm gonna like it!
You know, that's why I read reviews: good ones (like that one) always tell you all you need to know! You just have to read beyond the opinion of the reviewer and not condemn him for it...
Anyway, have fun with the record!! ;-)
idk y you would go around copy and pasting the same review but what ever you want to do is ok i guess
And i read some more reviews, and they keep saying that the album is too different and branches off too much. And the new linkin park album doesnt? In my opinion it does more. But we can still give it good reviews, dont worry.
idk y you would go around copy and pasting the same review but what ever you want to do is ok i guess>>>
joe, most of the time if I see something on the web that I've commented on previously somewhere else, I'll do the same thing. It's logical. Who wants to type up the same comments again?
And he's not arguing against giving them good reviews, just like I'm not, but he is talking about blind fanaticism, which I think happens to be the case with 50% of these comments here.
And mike, I think it's less about the blind fanatacism then it is about the relief that they didn't put out "Conspiracy of One" part 2. I think we can all agree that would have been far worse
"You're Gonna Go Far, Kid" still sounds like Fall Out Boy and Panic! to me, but like I said in the review, it is saved by that Offspring edge, and it's been stuck in my head all day, too. "Gone Away" like heights? Hell no. That's my favorite song from this band to this day and one of the reasons why I still even care about this band. The ending when Holland breaks down and screams still gets me, even after a decade.
Anyway, what kills this album still is that second half. It's like they stopped caring. And I also wish I had never watched that God forsaken music video for "Hammerhead" because now I can't stop thinking about that video's PS1-styled graphics and the missed-the-mark imagery. But, that's just my fault. Hah.
Like Splinter (which actually has some solid songs and better production style than this, in my book), I'll salvage some songs from this release, but for the most part, this is still such a disappointment to me.
I know it's pointless to argue about this on the internet of all places, but i can't help but feel in a lot of reviewers hearts this album was doomed to get a positive review merely because of Splinter and the complete lack of hype around it
On the one hand I'm hearing familiar riffs from Noodles that are always a pleasure to listen to, and the track 'Shit Is Fucked Up' honestly made me laugh my ass off (in a good way) towards the end with a fast-paced ass-reaming of corporate America (think of Americana on hyper-drive).
On the other, the overall tone is both generic and confusing. They try to rock you with the first half, and then it drifts into a bad pop/punk stereotype.
As a whole, it's digestible and not bad compared to Splinter, but I can't deny the obvious - after hearing Hammerhead, and with all of the hype and time it took to get this release, it's a bit of a let-down.
And for the record, I give Holland credit for Kristy, Are You Doin' Okay? for it's meaning and good intent...but we all know what good intentions do.
Kudos on the attempt, but I think it could have been better.
the album goes back towards the band's more popular days with sounds closer to that of smash and ixnay
Fire this bastard.
p.s. greenday blows
Are you Kurt Russell or do you know him?
;p
I agree with you all the way Michael, the Offspring should not have tried to take a step forward and be anyway creative, it defies everything punk!!!!! Sacrilege I say sacrilege!!!!
Trupunx for ever!!!
sorry I've changed my mind, I recommend you to listen to it again Michael, I can't stop listening to it now. I know how you feel, it's how I thought of the album until I re-listened to it a few times.
the resemblance of some of the songs to others is only normal .. i dont think dexter just sat there contimplating what would make a good rip off .. and i could point out other resemblences in all the other songs if u want, offspring's songs and non-offsprings songs. it all depends on what you are listening to round the time u write the song ..
now i like this album,it's no smash, but this actually makes it all the better .. coz u know smash was and still is great and one of my favotrite of all time .. but i still wanna hear some new shit ..
i love the first half its absolutely amzing and actually measures up to their old stuff, and "stuff is messed up" is pretty good and doesn't sound like a joke song, though i personally enjoy these joke songs especially the offspring's joke songs ..
now kristy is decent and the whole album would have been five stars if "Rise and Fall, Nothingtown and Fix you" weren't there, coz it would be just perfect and got it all if it had "Let's hear it for rock bottom" as the last song ..
oh and i think the production is pretty good too ..
Dexter has said the album is part experimental, part standard Offspring, and it is just that. The ballads don't work for me either, but it is different and that's what they were going for. I still can't figure out what the hell is up with Fix You...awful. Holland' vocal style doesn't suit that kind of song at all! Overall I enjoy the sound of the album though :) (with the exception of the last few songs)
Even though I do not agree with a lot of it , I must give you credit for writing a good review. It demonstrates your opinion very well so good job man
personally I would rate it 90% but
an unbiased fair rating is 70-80%
50% is just insanely biased and lack of judgement
First off, our writers are not assholes, and any judgment passed onto anything we review is 100% unbiased.
Secondly, the fact you would rate it 90% is based on your personal opinion. That does not stand against the general consensus of what is deemed a "public opinion." Read this site's comments alone and you'll see that many of the comments not only support Mike's review, but praise him for saying things that most people tend to miss. You may want to read more after this.
Thirdly, an unbiased review rating is not necessarily 70%-80%. Go read both my Protest The Hero and Black Mountain album reviews. I never heard anything from these bands until early this year. Protest The Hero made a great album; Black Mountain made an average album. How's that for bias?
Lastly, you say that 50% of this review is based on insanity and/or lack of judgment. You sir fail to see the reasonings behind Roffman's review and frankly, I agree with Mike. The Offspring have consistently been on the wrong end of the gene pool the past few years. How can a band come out with an explosion album such as "Smash" ranging with topics from school violence, self-esteem, bad anger habits and the works, to a gutteral, declining state of maturity with songs such as "Pretty Fly (For A White Guy)" or "Original Prankster"? Excuse me, but after reading this review and honestly admitting not to listening to a single note of this album, I can rest assured that given Mike's words, thoughts and feelings, this album fails to revive them from the past. Get a true view of the world and quit being so blinded. Seriously!